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The Mac theme/scrollbar issue

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rodii
 
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Post Posted June 18th, 2008, 2:47 pm

I've pored over these forums looking for the definitive answer to this, and gotten lots of pieces of the puzzle but no clear way forward, so I'm posting here in hopes of collecting ideas.

I have the common problem of invisible scrollbars in non-default themes (FF3, MacOS 10.5.3). This is even true in the case of themes that have been updated to 3.0. I gather it's been caused in part by switching back to the old old scheme of having only one scrollbars.css file (not xulscrollbars.css and nativescrollbars.css)--themes that base their new scrollbars.css file on their old xulscrollbars.css are having disappearing scrollbar issues on Macs. What I can't quite nail down, if this is true, is what the fix should be.

I really dislike the default Mac theme, but I also dislike not having scrollbars. So I thought I might be able to tweak an existing theme if I understood the problem, and maybe this thread could be a resource for others (users or theme developers) that are trying to fix this. Thanks for any help.

aaron

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Post Posted June 18th, 2008, 3:21 pm

I'm also looking for a fix! If one can be found, I will update all ten of my themes ASAP and get the fix out there for you Mac users.

mcdavis

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Post Posted June 18th, 2008, 4:52 pm

My approach was to move xulscrollbars.css to a new file called scrollbars.css, and then have that one file imported by both of the others (nativescrollbars.css and xulscrollbars.css).

In my notes (Dec 29, 2007 ... how I spent my Christmas vacation ...) I have:

- Aronnax reports that for XUL scrollbars to work on the Mac, the contents of theme file chrome://global/skin/nativescrollbars.css need to be identical to the contents of chrome://global/skin/xulscrollbars.css.
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mcdavis

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Post Posted June 18th, 2008, 7:46 pm

Here's some more data points.

viewtopic.php?f=18&t=637709
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Arvid Axelsson
 
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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 5:11 am

mcdavis941 wrote:My approach was to move xulscrollbars.css to a new file called scrollbars.css, and then have that one file imported by both of the others (nativescrollbars.css and xulscrollbars.css).


Is that "approach" an actual solution or ...? I based my themes on the default theme and have only scrollbars.css so I don't really know how to apply this. Or is there no known solution?

aaron

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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 6:18 am

Talked to mcdavis about it and he doesn't use native scrollbars in his NNL theme.

So far, no solution on this one yet....

mcdavis

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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 7:54 am

Arvid Axelsson wrote:Is that "approach" an actual solution or ...? I based my themes on the default theme and have only scrollbars.css so I don't really know how to apply this. Or is there no known solution?


It's an actual solution for non-native scrollbars.

As far as native scollbars, I haven't looked at it, but could you do something with chrome.manifest using OS-specific settings to get whatever you need?

Code: Select all
skin global classic/1.0 jar:classic.jar!/skin/classic/macos/global/ os=darwin
skin global classic/1.0 jar:classic.jar!/skin/classic/global/ os=WINNT
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rodii
 
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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 4:34 pm

Well, this is reassuring: it's not just me. Bugzilla's not much help either, since every bug touching on this is marked INVALID because it's not the default theme. Either there is a solution, in which case it should be documented, or there isn't, in which case it should be fixed.

Are there *any* themes beside the default that have working native scrollbars in FF3/Mac?

KLB

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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 6:06 pm

This thread was brought to my attention by another Mozillazine member. This problem was cause by major changes to the way scrollbars are handled by Firefox as of version 3.0b3. I first started beating my head against this issue back in March and have spent countless hours on it. Since I'm sure this will be a recurring issue for theme developers I have started a thread on the scrollbar issue that details everything I know about it at: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=682635
Ken Barbalace - AMO Editor (I focus on reviewing themes)
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Arvid Axelsson
 
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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 6:13 pm

mcdavis941 wrote:As far as native scollbars, I haven't looked at it, but could you do something with chrome.manifest using OS-specific settings to get whatever you need?

Thanks. So as I understand it, if you create two copies of the global folder, except one of them having the scrollbars.css from Windows default and the other from Mac OS X default, that should do it? Is there a way to avoid having to duplicate the whole folder? How does that work with other platforms, should I omit "os=WINNT" to have that one apply to all but Mac OS X?

mcdavis

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Post Posted June 19th, 2008, 7:26 pm

@KLB: Thanks for the great write-up!

@Arvid:

Arvid Axelsson wrote:Thanks. So as I understand it, if you create two copies of the global folder, except one of them having the scrollbars.css from Windows default and the other from Mac OS X default, that should do it?


Unproven concept but yes that's the idea. That's what I'd try if I were going for native scrollbars.

KLB -- what do you think?

Is there a way to avoid having to duplicate the whole folder


I think no (except you can exclude any files specific to the scrollbar not used by that platform). In the Fx3 default theme, for aero vs. xp, almost all of the files are duplicated.

How does that work with other platforms, should I omit "os=WINNT" to have that one apply to all but Mac OS X?


I think that's how it works. The MDC Chrome Registration page has been updated for most of this. ( http://developer.mozilla.org/en/docs/Ch ... gistration )
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KLB

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Post Posted June 20th, 2008, 5:53 am

mcdavis941 wrote:@KLB: Thanks for the great write-up!

It was needed because a lot of developers will waste a lot of time on this issue. It was really frustrating for me because Firefox developers broke things with a major change that should not have been made so late in the beta process. Then when the problem was brought to their attention they decided it wasn't important enough to fix before Firefox 3.0 was released. Updating themes from Firefox 2.0 to Firefox 3.0 is hard enough as is, Firefox developers should not have left a bug that crippled theme development so badly unfixed. :x

We really need to lobby to get this bug fixed.

mcdavis941 wrote:KLB -- what do you think?

Is there a way to avoid having to duplicate the whole folder


I don't know for sure, but I kind of doubt it. If it is possible, then it would require someone who understands the OS switch in themes better than I do.

The easiest way I could figure out to work around this issue was to create custom scrollbars, which got me around the native scrollbar issues.
Ken Barbalace - AMO Editor (I focus on reviewing themes)
I maintain Classic Compact, a very compact yet clean Firefox theme.
EnvironmentalChemistry.com (Periodic Table)

Arvid Axelsson
 
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Post Posted June 20th, 2008, 1:12 pm

Can anyone test this on Mac OS X: [removed link]
Last edited by Arvid Axelsson on June 20th, 2008, 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KLB

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Post Posted June 20th, 2008, 4:05 pm

After getting a request from someone for permission to use my custom scrollbars in their theme, I have made my scrollbar related files available for download from my scrollbar thread I mentioned above (http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=682635). This will aid those who want to take an easy out with the Windows/Mac scrollbar issue.
Ken Barbalace - AMO Editor (I focus on reviewing themes)
I maintain Classic Compact, a very compact yet clean Firefox theme.
EnvironmentalChemistry.com (Periodic Table)

mcdavis

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Post Posted June 20th, 2008, 5:21 pm

Arvid Axelsson wrote:Can anyone test this on Mac OS X?


A quick look shows (nice places icons BTW):

- in the library window, search box is clipped off against right window boundary (as if it had a negative right margin ... it's cropped right through the middle of the search close button)
- in the library window, a focus outline shows when clicking the two right-most menus ("Views" and "Import and Export") but not when clicking the Organize menu
- main browser back and forward buttons have two extra dropmarkers ... actually this is true in all toolbar modes
- the star popup (editBookmarkPanel) folder menulist has an extra dropmarker inside it ... also the menulist on the customize toolbars sheet ... looks like all menulists are the same, actually
- on tabpanels (e.g. Options > Advanced) for tabs on either side of the selected one, the outline/background isn't drawn
- menus on the screen menu bar look good (including the icons) but popup menus in the app itself (context menus, the search engine menu) seem a little crowded vertically
- when you hover toolbar buttons, the bottom border (bright) overlaps the dark bottom border of the toolbar itself and puts a bright gap in the dark border. also for toolbarbuttons in the bookmarks toolbar.

The scrollbars look good and seem to be working fine on both Windows (tried it there too) and on the Mac.

(I hope this isn't too picky ... it's a great-looking theme! That throbber is cool.)
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