Discussion For WebMedia Video Format(WebM) in Minefield

[NoNameAtAll]

http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/21/goog ... -all-says/

I'm not liking the sounds of this.

Also pardon me if it's off topic. I just found this troublesome. You know.

If I'm reading this wrong, then disregard me.

[GTK66]

http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/21/googles-webm-video-format-might-not-be-so-free-after-all-says/

I'm not liking the sounds of this.

Also pardon me if it's off topic. I just found this troublesome. You know.

If I'm reading this wrong, then disregard me.

I don't believe you are. The lawyers can figure it all out.

http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/ ... /?news=123

[Omega X]

Yeah, MPEG-LA is trying to spook supporters like it was trying to do with Theora.

If Google did its due diligence right, then this is going to be no more than a waste of money for them.

[sabret00the]

You guys shouldn't get sucked into the FUD. You don't think that between the time Google bought ON2 and now, they didn't have lawyers go through this stuff with a fine-tooth comb?

[patrickjdempsey]

Yeah, MPEG-LA is trying to spook supporters like it was trying to do with Theora.

If Google did its due diligence right, then this is going to be no more than a waste of money for them.

Let's see... one of the worlds most powerful companies, who have been in the midst of copyright-related threats for years now, buys ON2 in February. Three months later they announce WebM. I doubt the wait had to do with making up a catchy name. The fear-tactics and FUD is exactly how MPEG-LA operates. They are working with an assumption and threatening suit if the assumption turns out to be correct.... but either way, making the threat is part of their promise to their nervous partners. It's classic animalistic threat / response. Have the patent-related threats against Apple caused them to stop making iPhones? Has Apple's patent-related threats against HTC caused them to stop making phones. No and no. And why is that? Because it's all a bunch of hooey and fear tactics and an attempt to bog down the competition in litigation. Anyone who honestly thinks they are going to bog down Google's gears has another think coming.

[NoNameAtAll]

You guys shouldn't get sucked into the FUD. You don't think that between the time Google bought ON2 and now, they didn't have lawyers go through this stuff with a fine-tooth comb?

I'm not. I just always seem to fear the worst whenever I see stuff like that.

I don't doubt that Google thought this through.

[patrickjdempsey]

I don't doubt that Google thought this through.

And don't doubt either that Apple has been sitting on their laurels waiting for another oppurtunity to attack Google. I'm not a fan of everything that Google does, but the only thing Apple seems to attack them for are the GOOD things they do.

[patrickjdempsey]

Due diligence:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/05/20 ... d_patents/

[Omega X]

I need a better encoder. The WildFire free encoder crashes during the encode if you make too many custom settings.

Hopefully the FFMPEG2theora developer will compile one soon.

[Binary Alchemist]

Hi, first post! Hopefully I won't break anything On the MPEG-LA vs. Google issue, I couldn't help but thinking of this (humor bit ahead; be nice):

Finally, Larry Horn (MPEG-LA CEO) could be located for comments on their stance on WebM and the formation of a patent pool, having this to say:

(To all parties but Google)
Roll up, roll up for the mystery pool.
Roll up, roll up for the mystery pool.
Roll up (AND) THAT'S AN INVITATION, roll up for the mystery pool.
Roll up TO MAKE A RESERVATION, roll up for the mystery pool.

(To Google)
The magical mystery pool is coming to take you away,
Coming to take you away.
The magical mystery pool is dying to take you away,
Dying to take you away, take you today...

[b0nyb0y]

More reading:
http://lists.xiph.org/pipermail/theora/ ... 03769.html
http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wi ... 47795.html

The 2nd one is of special interest to me. Hope there will soon be lots of "pure encoder side techniques" coming to VP8 encoder as well.

[Adrian1]

When the webm will be integrated in the normal night builds of minefield?

[_Alexander]

Media Player Classic. Not bloatware as it is useful in minimising CPU utilisation.

MPC sucks. MPC:HC is the only way to go.

CoreAVC is not even a free decoder, let alone free-to-encode, which is what WebM is here for among other factors.

Yes and h264 is currently free and still has non-free codecs. The same will be with VP8.
I support non-free: Office 2007 > OO.org (no formula support, messes up formatting of docx files), Windows 7 > Ubuntu 10 (Linux), CoreAVC > ffdshow (massive performance difference).

WebM isn't gunning for the performance crown as a top priority, if I understand the impetus behind it.

Bingo. This is exactly why it should die.

[teoli2003]

CoreAVC is not even a free decoder, let alone free-to-encode, which is what WebM is here for among other factors.

Yes and h264 is currently free and still has non-free codecs.

Wrong. You have to pay in the US if you want to use a software decoder for H264 (or encoder). If the author of the software you are using has not paid, you have to do this, or you are criminal and should be punished.

[trieste]

Media Player Classic. Not bloatware as it is useful in minimising CPU utilisation.

MPC sucks. MPC:HC is the only way to go.

I'm using MPC:HC. MPC:HC is still MPC. Doh.

WebM isn't gunning for the performance crown as a top priority, if I understand the impetus behind it.

Bingo. This is exactly why it should die.

This is exactly why WebM is important. Not gunning for the performance crown as a top priority doesn't mean it can never gain the performance crown. It just means that some people know what is more important for the internet: free encoding and decoding without patent trolls to muddy the waters.

What works well for you and to your delight does not for others, and probably does not for the majority of others (i.e. the internet). I paid for Office 2007 and Windows 7, and damn they're good (though Office 2010 is even better, after having tried the beta), but I also have OpenOffice on my computer and Ubuntu readily downloadable. The choice to have free products (free as in beer, free as in open) is important, and WebM provides that choice in the internet video arena.