IE Compatible

[TheRealBeale]

This will raise a few hackles, but I want to say it.

Why does Mozilla/Phoenix not support IE style Javascript. I use JavaScript a lot when developing, but use Internet Explorer as my default browser. Subsequently, I write Javascript which works for Internet Explorer and don't write code for Mozilla browsers. Market share has been stolen by MS so writing code compatible for both browsers doesn't seem worth the hassle.

Mozilla will surely never be able to increase its market share unless it conforms to MS standard javascript, as so many sites which use it do so because there is a critical mass of users who use IE. In order to get back these users, surely they would use Mozilla, only if they know it will work as well as, hopefully better, than a Microsoft product.

Much as I'd love to use Mozilla as my default browser, I'd still prefer not to have to write two sets of code for each type of browser, doubling my workload in coding and testing. Why can't Mozilla cope with both types of Javascript?

Am I being thoroughly stupid? Is this just a copyright issue, if so I step down and retract. (Considering Microsoft were guilty of stealing the browser market, it would only be fair to make efforts to steal it back again.) Or is this all about pride?

I expect a bit of a beating for saying all this!

Beale

[bob_seb]

Much as I'd love to use Mozilla as my default browser, I'd still prefer not to have to write two sets of code for each type of browser, doubling my workload in coding and testing. Why can't Mozilla cope with both types of Javascript?

In fact, you don't have to write two sets of code for each type of browser, you have to write ONE standard compliant set of code, and ALL standard compliant browser will work nice. Even IE is able to do most of standard compliant Javascript, so...

Am I being thoroughly stupid? Is this just a copyright issue, if so I step down and retract. (Considering Microsoft were guilty of stealing the browser market, it would only be fair to make efforts to steal it back again.) Or is this all about pride?

It is already very time-consuming to support the standards well, mozilla.org can't afford to implement all proprietary javascript variants ! You will say that IE's case is particular, since it is the dominant browser, but if Mozilla go this way, what will stop MS to extend there own version of JS and force the others to try to follow them ? All that can't react to the always changing MS specifications will be lost in track, and MS will win.
The only solution is to implement and to promote true standards that everybody can follow with the certainty that they will not evolve erratically.

[herman]

Mozilla will surely never be able to increase its market share unless it conforms to MS standard javascript, as so many sites which use it do so because there is a critical mass of users who use IE.

Beale

It is not "MS standard Javascript", it´s "MS-style javascript", or jscript.
Why should mozilla care about "standards" defined by a company,
which doesn´t care at all about standards, changes even their own at will?
Have a look at doc-files, and word-versions.

Mozilla should adhere to w3c-standards.

www.w3c.org

[aab]

Subsequently, I write Javascript which works for Internet Explorer and don't write code for Mozilla browsers.

You're making things hard for yourself. You can build pretty complex interfaces and applications without needing to rewrite for each browser. Maybe few conditions to overcome some quirks (usually IE quirks) here and there but thats fairly trivial for regular scripting tasks. Take a week or two break from MS kowledgebase and look at many fine sites/tutorials about crossbrowser scripting.

Start with examples at http://www.xs4all.nl/~ppk/js/index.html and check out compatibility table there, that should give you good start.

[itsmarcos]

Yes jscript (or whatever they call it) is non W3C compliant. There's was a poll on supporting activex or not on the mozila builds forum. I posted <a href="http://www.mozillazine.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=753&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15">this</a> message there explaining why I believe mozilla should support IE functionality. I think the same applies to jscript.

[Sander]

Subsequently, I write Javascript which works for Internet Explorer and don't write code for Mozilla browsers.

Could you define what you mean with "Javascript which works for Internet Explorer"? If you're just talking about document.all then you're running way behind the times... document.getElementById (and similar) is the standards compliant way to access all those elements, and has been working in IE since version 5.0
(so instead of doing something like document.all['menu1'].style.visibility = 'hidden'; you do document.getElementById('menu1').style.visibility = 'hidden';)

If on the other hand you're not talking about such basics, then what differences are you talking about?

[amun]

Refering to the topic...

I use the open.window js:

javascript:void(window.open('news.html','neues1','WIDTH=500,HEIGHT=500,RESIZABLE=yes,TOOLBAR=NO'))

this work quit good with mozilla IE and some other borwser, but not with phoenix....
Has someone an idea why ?

hm ups.... wrong forum.... i though this was phoenis forum

[greg]

easy one: popup blocking? It's default in phoenix.

[johann_p]

... Subsequently, I write Javascript which works for Internet Explorer and don't write code for Mozilla browsers.

Why don't you write Javascript code that works with both? It can be done, there
zillions of sites that do it. Learn how to code standard JS and query for supported
features. Then you will be able to write code that works for practically all modern
browsers, not just the two you believe to "support".

[doron]

[quote="TheRealBeale"]This will raise a few hackles, but I want to say it.

Why does Mozilla/Phoenix not support IE style Javascript. I use JavaScript a lot when developing, but use Internet Explorer as my default browser. Subsequently, I write Javascript which works for Internet Explorer and don't write code for Mozilla browsers. Market share has been stolen by MS so writing code compatible for both browsers doesn't seem worth the hassle.

Mozilla will surely never be able to increase its market share unless it conforms to MS standard javascript, as so many sites which use it do so because there is a critical mass of users who use IE. In order to get back these users, surely they would use Mozilla, only if they know it will work as well as, hopefully better, than a Microsoft product.

Much as I'd love to use Mozilla as my default browser, I'd still prefer not to have to write two sets of code for each type of browser, doubling my workload in coding and testing. Why can't Mozilla cope with both types of Javascript?

Beale[/quote]

Mozilla and IE's JavaScript engines both conform to the ecma standard.

What you are confusing is DOM accessing probably, such as document.all in IE, while mozilla follows the w3c.org standard. It has nothing to do with different javascript implementations.

You can easily write one set of code for both browsers, its not that hard, I do it all the time.

[chrookee]

You are better of writing code that works for a standards compliant browser rather than a Company specific browser.
Browsers like IE may have market share but their stability, reliability and security is definitely questionable.
You also have the added problem when MS decides to suddenly move to a different standard then you suffer, point being the recent changes to IE 6 in the XML area where they broke compatibility with previous browsers.
Like every mozilla/phoenix/standards aware person would tell you...stick to the standards.... they are there for a purpose.
Anyways rather than write code exclusively for IE try writing code exclusively for Mozilla... and hey presto! what do you know it works on IE, Opera, Konqueror and Phoenix and Chimera.

Just a thought.