ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Discuss various technical topics not related to Mozilla.
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Grumpus
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ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Grumpus »

Frankly I'm probably too old school to want anything to do with this and admittedly it scares me.
The idea of falsehoods represented as fact is worrisome enough without creating a method for a machine to wander helter skelter appears publicly to lack a high degree of foresight. Listening to one of the creators on the news, who brought up this kind of concern, it seems sometimes various technical improvements or help mates have gone horribly wrong as the preventatives have not been calculated before the release. The mention of rogue states having a ball with whatever shenanigans they can envision is only one of many issues which need to be considered.
Qualification doesn't matter for discussion and in my case there was a wander with a program back in the eighties called Level 5 (AI programming)
:-k
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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I see loads of potential cons and very few legitimate pros.
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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Last edited by morat on May 5th, 2023, 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Grumpus »

Kind of glad they closed this down but . . . Psychedelic pack animal
It's still available to anyone who wants it, egads!
The idea advertisers, marketing scoundrels, questionable business types, politicians , Pacs or some other nuisance makes this little and too late to protect the general public.
Add this to Meta requiring copies of peoples identification in the form of Driver's licenses ( no real hacker target there) what makes people think any of this is worthwhile.
There appears to be no way of securing the Internet of Things or the Internet for that matter.
Years ago an out of control doctor having his own little tool pouch with just enough tools to do damage to medical electro-mechanical devices was dealt with in the best possible manner.
When away from the laboratory/hospital one of the service machinists in the now defunct shop took his screw drivers, heated the metal and pulled them from the plastic handles.
He ground off the capture tangs cut a groove for a circlip inside the handle and in the metal blade to match depth.
A ball bearing was placed in the bottom of the hole and the screw driver re-assembled and the pouch replaced in the doctors office.
It helped some but may have gone a little further than leaving the know it all with available.misguided function,
Thanks anyway Stanford we can only hope it's a start for others, then again who knows what the fixits at other institutions and business will do.
8-[
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Grumpus »

Is it a misunderstanding, this GPT4 and the evil empire can be misused by naughty programmers?
It seems to me none of the AI which is being exponentially developed and deployed is going to be to any standard, granted open source, but out of control right from the start.
It would seem there is an assumption the ne'er do wells are smart enough. :roll:
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Kevin McFarlane »

Grumpus wrote:Frankly I'm probably too old school to want anything to do with this and admittedly it scares me.
The idea of falsehoods represented as fact is worrisome enough without creating a method for a machine to wander helter skelter appears publicly to lack a high degree of foresight.
When you are feeding it search-like questions all it's doing is collating information that you might have found more slowly over several manual searches and then creating words around it. Conventional searches can also return false or "worrisome" information too.

I've been playing around with several of these engines now. Most of them also provide source links for their results, so you can examine those sources and see whether you trust them or not. Bing Chat uses GPT (an up-to-date version) but you can click through the supporting links.

A channel I found recently that does a good job of analysing all this, including strengths and weaknesses, is AI Explained.
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Grumpus »

Understanding the function and variations of AI and applications is not somewhere in the aether.
What concerns me is the inability for the average user and general population to have enough sense of awareness of those avenues of verification you suggest. It's too easy to write a horror or sci-fi novel based on what if's and to do so might just encourage the less than noble. It's a normal human condition. You can't even liken it to the application nuclear energy because it has a more extensive area of possible application.
Like I said, probably too old a monkey to see the possibility without the negatives.
It appears the application and the possibility of misuse and error, not just by errant question/answer assembly, but humans,wicked or ignorant have a heavier weight at present than positives. The last thing needed is more information confusion and misdirection.

One example AI applied improperly:
Early childhood development, selection of education avenue direction left to AI programs without sufficient review.
Knowing the half-assed way some school boards operate and the shiftless administrations of some around the US . . .
. . . it would be more devastating.
It's tough enough for people to apply good direction but the lack of humanity would be catastrophic.
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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Just a final thought as it's already too late for any substantive discussion.
Must have missed the call to post . . .and their off
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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When Windows 95 came out there was a loud sigh and a few tears at what was being lost.
Yesterday in the Register an article stated Europol had noted ChatGPT (or derivation) had already been used by the overtly naughty.
This morning it is being touted as many as 300 Million jobs will be lost to it's application.
Lost jobs and crime do not make a lofty goal for any system or software.
The way it looks is it's the same ugly baby in a new dress, "Get it out there, no matter the consequence and lets just see what happens."
While David Farragut is supposed to have said, "Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead." he at least knew there would be torpedoes.
The ChatGPT and derivative bunch don't know what's in the water and have decided to use everyone as guinea pigs, much like the release of W95.
](*,)
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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Similar article in the Register. UK suggests light touch
Makes no sense to apply a light touch as it's already out in the wild and unlikely anyone will be dissuaded from any creative research.
. . . but, the suicide mentioned in the article shows the way this can go wrong, regardless of the mental status of the deceased.
This is may be a whole new area for science fiction writers, AI cat-fishing people without reason or cause or maybe something more sinister. :-k
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Kevin McFarlane »

Grumpus wrote: It appears the application and the possibility of misuse and error, not just by errant question/answer assembly, but humans,wicked or ignorant have a heavier weight at present than positives. The last thing needed is more information confusion and misdirection.
How would you recommend we deal with this? The only viable solution is an open marketplace of ideas. Governments and the Establishment in general hate this but we have seen, and are seeing, right now, that their attempts at solving it by suppressing misinformation and disinformation (and even malinformation, meaning true but inconvenient statements) are disastrous. E.g., see the Twitter Files and the recent and ongoing US Congressional Hearings. The Establishment – and the newly coined Censorship Industrial Complex - has repeatedly and provably created mis/disinformation in the very act of combatting it. My view is that if anyone thinks information is “mis/disinformation” they should provide reasons and evidence to show why it is false and then publish that information. Merely citing the WHO or the CDC is not enough.
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Kevin McFarlane »

Grumpus wrote:When Windows 95 came out there was a loud sigh and a few tears at what was being lost.
What was lost when Windows 95 came out? I don’t understand.
This morning it is being touted as many as 300 Million jobs will be lost to it's application.
90% of people used to work in agriculture. What happened to them as the number of people required to work the land plummeted? They moved into newly created industries. It’s the nature of capitalism. Industries are destroyed. New ones are created in their place. And also the number of workers required in any particular line of work tends to decrease over time too.

People suspect that with AI it will be different this time. Perhaps. I think it will need at minimum autonomous humanoid AGI (Artificial General Intelligence).
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

Post by Kevin McFarlane »

Grumpus wrote: . . . but, the suicide mentioned in the article shows the way this can go wrong, regardless of the mental status of the deceased.
Following through to here we read...
However, about two years ago, the first signs of trouble started to appear. The man became very eco-anxious and found refuge with ELIZA, the name given to a chatbot that uses GPT-J, an open-source artificial intelligence language model developed by EleutherAI. After six weeks of intensive exchanges, he took his own life.
They give no indication of what the Chat was telling him to make him kill himself. Maybe feeding him over-the-top climate alarmism saying we have 10 years to save the planet?
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Re: ChatGPT or derivations - Pros and cons

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Who is Frank Lion from mozillazine?
2 seconds later....
https://chat.openai.com/chat replies
Frank Lion is a long-time contributor and moderator on the Mozillazine forum, which is a community-driven support forum for Mozilla software, including the Firefox web browser and Thunderbird email client. Frank has been a member of the forum since 2005 and has contributed to numerous discussions on a wide range of topics related to Mozilla software, including troubleshooting, tips and tricks, and feature requests. He is known for his expertise and helpfulness in assisting other users with their Mozilla-related issues.
Fast, but also not totally accurate.
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