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User Help for Seamonkey and Mozilla Suite
amrad
 
Posts: 2282
Joined: May 29th, 2004, 9:01 pm
Location: UK

Post Posted March 9th, 2019, 10:09 am

Hello Dan,

DanRaisch wrote:6) Marking a message to be deleted only tells SeaMonkey to "hide" that message, that is, not display it in the message list pane. The data remains in the message file on the hard drive so the file size remains the same as before the deletion.

Not only deleted but also mail that has been moved to another folder. ;)

Regards,

Dave.

amrad
 
Posts: 2282
Joined: May 29th, 2004, 9:01 pm
Location: UK

Post Posted March 9th, 2019, 12:47 pm

Hello Bqumgrenze,

baumgrenze wrote:2) How do I get the mail client interface to display the inbox in the Onemain profile.

I think you should find that the Onemain Inbox will be created the first time you receive an email, you could send yourself one to see if that causes the Inbox to appear, I'm not sure but it may only appear after restarting SeaMonkey, it's a long time since I was in that position! ;)

Incidentally, if you create an Inbox folder (which you can only do if there isn't already an Inbox folder!) it won't behave like the one created by SeaMonkey, in so far as the one created by SeaMonkey appears as the first folder under the main account and not, as one might expect, in it's correct alphabetical position in the folder tree, which is what happens with one you create. There must be some attribute of the Seamonkey created one that makes it immune from alphabetical sorting but the one you create, is subject to that sorting. The same must also apply to the other 'system' folders, Drafts, Templates, Sent, etc. Also, you can't rename a 'system' folder, unlike ones you create. By the way, most of these folders are usually created the first time you try to access them, by, for example, sending an email for the first time will create the Sent folder and saving an email for the first will create the Drafts folder.

baumgrenze wrote:3) I'm not clear about the 'standard' structure of the Folder Pane. I believe we are using the term Local Folders differently.

I've always thought that when the 'Local Folders' were mentioned, it was to the 'Local Folders' in SeaMonkey, rather than all the folders in SeaMonkey being 'local' rather than on the mail server, except for IMAP where such a distinction seems reasonable.

I haven't ever used the Local Folders, preferring to keep all my mail in the main account. In the link to Local Folders, it mentions using a Global Inbox (that is: the Local Folders Inbox which, in this situation, is automatically created) and says "If you configure a POP account to use a Global Inbox, the new messages are downloaded into an Inbox folder in Local Folders, and the POP accounts folders are hidden in the folder pane." To me, that is a reason for /not/ using them! ;)

baumgrenze wrote:2) As I looked at mine and read Dave's suggestion I could see merit in something like a simple alphabetical breakdown that when expanded reveals all folders A-E, F-J, etc With many subfolders, I've found it tedious to file selected files to drag from a Name or Sender sorted Inbox into the appropriate subfolder in Local Folders since they do not all fit on the screen.

When I receive any email, after I have read them, I move them to an appropriate folder or sub-folder, then I compact my Inbox (it's not essential to do this, as long as the folders are compacted on a regular basis) so it is completely empty for most of the time. I have found this arrangement to be entirely satisfactory and don't find it tedious.

Isn't it the case that, with an folder containing mail sorted by date that they don't all fit on the screen?

Dragging email from one folder to another is one method, you can also move them by clicking on File and selecting the destination folder from the lists shown, Recent, Main Account or Local Folders.

My Folder pane is organised by having a folder for every person or organisation with whom I exchange emails, I also have some folders for a group of contacts with the same interest and have subfolders for each person/organisation in that group.

Maybe this will show what I mean (Ignore the dots, they're just for keeping the list organised!):

<>Dave's Sky Broadband Account
....................| Inbox
....................| Drafts
....................| Templates
....................| Sent
....................| Archives
....................| Junk
....................| Deleted (Trash)
....................| Unsent Messages
....................| Affinity Water
....................| Aiwa
....................| Alan
....................| Alexandra Palace (The Birthplace of High Definition Television!)
....................<> Amateur Radio
...............................| Adrian
...............................| Andrew
...............................| Chris
...............................| Duncan
...............................| GB3HV + HCATV Group
...............................| John
...............................| Mike
...............................| OFCOM (Equivalent to the US FCC)
...............................| Rallies
...............................| RSGB (Radio Society of Great Britain)
...............................| UK ATV Group
....................| Andy
....................| Asus
....................<> BATC ( British Amateur Television Club)
...............................| Andy
...............................| Brian
...............................| Chris
...............................| Dicky
...............................| Graham
...............................| Paul
...............................| Richard
....................<> BBC
...............................| BBC Shop
...............................| The Radio 4 Theme etc.
...............................| World Service
...............................| Written Archives
....................| British Gas
....................| British Government
....................| British Telecom
....................| Canon
....................| David
....................| DEC Disasters Emergency Committee
....................| EAC
..........| etc, etc.

It seems to me, that having a large number of messages in the Inbox, even if sorted by date, would make locating a specific email rather difficult!

baumgrenze wrote:6) As I delete mail and even subfolders should I see a corresponding reduction in the size of my Profile folder? Treesize Free tells me that ~40% of my available System Disk (a 128 Gb SSD) is dedicated to Windows and 19.3% to Mozilla Mail.

Provided you have compacted the folders afterwards, yes, there should be a corresponding reduction in the file size.

If you have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Regards,

Dave.

baumgrenze

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Location: Left Coast in Northern CA

Post Posted March 11th, 2019, 10:45 pm

Thank you, Dave, for your helpful suggestions and observations, both in your 07 Mar 2019, 11:44 and 09 Mar 2019, 11:47 posts you added to this thread.

In response to your very first point on 3/7/19, is a MozBackup a sufficient way to protect the Preferences file under Users? I see from the path structure it created that it only backed up the Roaming branch and did not do the same for the Local branch. Is this sufficient?

I found that I needed to create a new Account Name in order to be able to start downloading mail (Read Mail) to my SM client. Therefore my profile now contains another mail entry, pop.sonic-4.net.

I think I understand better how the system works. I logged the Mozilla folder under Users>MyName>AppData….using ZTreeWin, displayed all the logged files, tagged them, and string searched them for the Account Name at the top of the Folder Pane of my SM email client page (upper left corner), MyNameSonicPopMail, The search led me to the file 'prefs.js'. It is located here:

C:\Users\MyName\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\SeaMonkey\Profiles\xxxxxxxx.default\prefs.js

The line items that seem most relevant are:

user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory", "C:\\Users\\MyName\\AppData\\Roaming\\Mozilla\\SeaMonkey\\Profiles\\xxxxxxxx.default\\Mail\\pop.sonic-4.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory-rel", "[ProfD]Mail/pop.sonic-4.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.hostname", "pop.sonic.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.name", "My1stNameSonicPopMail");

Curiously, the entries for 'server1' are for Local Folders (See the example below:)

user_pref("mail.server.server1.directory", "C:\\Users\\MyName\\AppData\\Roaming\\Mozilla\\SeaMonkey\\Profiles\\xxxxxxxx.default\\Mail\\Local Folders");

Does this look problematic? Only some of the branches under Local Folders have associated *.sbd folders, the others have the branch name and an associated MSF File. That part of the Folder Pane seems to work fine. It does trouble me that in Windows Explorer the Local Folders entry is above the pop.***.net entries.

I will resist the temptation to edit the preferences.

Instead I will adjust your 07 Mar 2019 instructions modified to include "sonic-4.net" and will use it as the folder into which to move the other (renamed) pop.xxx.net folders.

Please confirm that MozBackup is sufficient protection and I will take the remaining steps.

Thanks again,
Thanks,

Baumgrenze

amrad
 
Posts: 2282
Joined: May 29th, 2004, 9:01 pm
Location: UK

Post Posted March 12th, 2019, 4:31 am

baumgrenze wrote:In response to your very first point on 3/7/19, is a MozBackup a sufficient way to protect the Preferences file under Users? I see from the path structure it created that it only backed up the Roaming branch and did not do the same for the Local branch. Is this sufficient?

I've never used MozBackup, so I can't really comment on it, sorry! If it doesn't include the Local Folders in the backup, it would only matter if there is any mail in them. If you're going to be moving such mail to a folder in the main account, then I wouldn't worry about it.

I'm a bit unsure about this because the Local Folders come under the Roaming folder so I would have expected everything under Roaming to be included. Can you post a screen capture of the MozBackup tree structure?

baumgrenze wrote:I found that I needed to create a new Account Name in order to be able to start downloading mail (Read Mail) to my SM client. Therefore my profile now contains another mail entry, pop.sonic-4.net.

That shouldn't have been necessary, was there a problem trying to download the mail? What error message, if any, did you get?

baumgrenze wrote:I think I understand better how the system works. I logged the Mozilla folder under Users>MyName>AppData….using ZTreeWin, displayed all the logged files, tagged them, and string searched them for the Account Name at the top of the Folder Pane of my SM email client page (upper left corner), MyNameSonicPopMail, The search led me to the file 'prefs.js'. It is located here:

C:\Users\MyName\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\SeaMonkey\Profiles\xxxxxxxx.default\prefs.js

The line items that seem most relevant are:

user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory", "C:\\Users\\MyName\\AppData\\Roaming\\Mozilla\\SeaMonkey\\Profiles\\xxxxxxxx.default\\Mail\\pop.sonic-4.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory-rel", "[ProfD]Mail/pop.sonic-4.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.hostname", "pop.sonic.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.name", "My1stNameSonicPopMail");

That all looks normal.

baumgrenze wrote:Curiously, the entries for 'server1' are for Local Folders (See the example below:)

user_pref("mail.server.server1.directory", "C:\\Users\\MyName\\AppData\\Roaming\\Mozilla\\SeaMonkey\\Profiles\\xxxxxxxx.default\\Mail\\Local Folders");

I think that would only happen if you had chosen to use a 'Global Inbox' as described here

baumgrenze wrote:Does this look problematic? Only some of the branches under Local Folders have associated *.sbd folders, the others have the branch name and an associated MSF File. That part of the Folder Pane seems to work fine. It does trouble me that in Windows Explorer the Local Folders entry is above the pop.***.net entries.

It's quite possible that only some of the branches under Local Folders will have associated .sbd folders because you only get them if a sub-folder was created in SeaMonkey, presumably, not all folders in Local Folders needed a sub-folder. You can also have sub-folders of sub-folders!

As for Local Folders being above the pop.***.net entries in Windows Explorer, that has no significance as to where the Local Folders appear in SeaMonkey. In fact, when first setting-up a mail account, the Local Folders appear at the top of the folder tree in the folders pane but eventually end up at the bottom! I don't know why that is!

baumgrenze wrote:I will adjust your 07 Mar 2019 instructions modified to include "sonic-4.net" and will use it as the folder into which to move the other (renamed) pop.xxx.net folders.

I thought you wanted to move all your mail to the onemain.com? I don't see the point in first moving them to sonic-4.net if you're eventually going to be moving them to onemain.com!

baumgrenze wrote:Please confirm that MozBackup is sufficient protection and I will take the remaining steps.

It does seem that, except for the Local Folders, MozBackup will be sufficient protection.
Regards,

Dave.

baumgrenze

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Posts: 289
Joined: January 14th, 2005, 5:57 pm
Location: Left Coast in Northern CA

Post Posted March 12th, 2019, 10:00 pm

amrad wrote:
baumgrenze wrote:In response to your very first point on 3/7/19, is a MozBackup a sufficient way to protect the Preferences file under Users? I see from the path structure it created that it only backed up the Roaming branch and did not do the same for the Local branch. Is this sufficient?

I've never used MozBackup, so I can't really comment on it, sorry! If it doesn't include the Local Folders in the backup, it would only matter if there is any mail in them. If you're going to be moving such mail to a folder in the main account, then I wouldn't worry about it.

In the end I did not trust MozBackup so I learned a bit more about ZTreeWin and used the AltM(irror) command to create a copy of my 'Mozillla' folder ('Users....Roaming\Mozilla) on my Data hard drive. I checked a few small mail folders and it seems to be complete.

I'm a bit unsure about this because the Local Folders come under the Roaming folder so I would have expected everything under Roaming to be included. Can you post a screen capture of the MozBackup tree structure?

Here's a link to a composite snip on Imgur.


https://imgur.com/a/l1HVzpy

baumgrenze wrote:I found that I needed to create a new Account Name in order to be able to start downloading mail (Read Mail) to my SM client. Therefore my profile now contains another mail entry, pop.sonic-4.net.

That shouldn't have been necessary, was there a problem trying to download the mail? What error message, if any, did you get?

baumgrenze wrote:I think I understand better how the system works. I logged the Mozilla folder under Users>MyName>AppData….using ZTreeWin, displayed all the logged files, tagged them, and string searched them for the Account Name at the top of the Folder Pane of my SM email client page (upper left corner), MyNameSonicPopMail, The search led me to the file 'prefs.js'. It is located here:

C:\Users\MyName\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\SeaMonkey\Profiles\xxxxxxxx.default\prefs.js

The line items that seem most relevant are:

user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory", "C:\\Users\\MyName\\AppData\\Roaming\\Mozilla\\SeaMonkey\\Profiles\\xxxxxxxx.default\\Mail\\pop.sonic-4.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory-rel", "[ProfD]Mail/pop.sonic-4.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.hostname", "pop.sonic.net");
user_pref("mail.server.server2.name", "My1stNameSonicPopMail");

That all looks normal.

baumgrenze wrote:Curiously, the entries for 'server1' are for Local Folders (See the example below:)

user_pref("mail.server.server1.directory", "C:\\Users\\MyName\\AppData\\Roaming\\Mozilla\\SeaMonkey\\Profiles\\xxxxxxxx.default\\Mail\\Local Folders");

I think that would only happen if you had chosen to use a 'Global Inbox' as described here

If I did chose a 'Global Inbox', it was in 'time out of mind' and I do not recall. The Local Folders seem to work OK and are presently located lower down than the Account folder that contains the Inbox into which mail is delivered.

The prefs.js lines that I quoted above tell me that pop.sonic-4.net is where the mail client will look to download new mail from Sonic's server. That is why I suggested that pop.sonic-4.net is the folder into which other pop.mail folders should be 'copied.' You used the word, 'copy' on 3/7/19. Did you mean I should leave a copy of the pop.mail folders where they are and also place a copy in the folder that prefs.js designates as the current place for mail?

I did not Snip/document the steps I took to get the mail working again since I started this thread. My recollection is that until I created a new account nothing happened when I invoked Get Mail.


baumgrenze wrote:Does this look problematic? Only some of the branches under Local Folders have associated *.sbd folders, the others have the branch name and an associated MSF File. That part of the Folder Pane seems to work fine. It does trouble me that in Windows Explorer the Local Folders entry is above the pop.***.net entries.

It's quite possible that only some of the branches under Local Folders will have associated .sbd folders because you only get them if a sub-folder was created in SeaMonkey, presumably, not all folders in Local Folders needed a sub-folder. You can also have sub-folders of sub-folders!

As for Local Folders being above the pop.***.net entries in Windows Explorer, that has no significance as to where the Local Folders appear in SeaMonkey. In fact, when first setting-up a mail account, the Local Folders appear at the top of the folder tree in the folders pane but eventually end up at the bottom! I don't know why that is!

baumgrenze wrote:I will adjust your 07 Mar 2019 instructions modified to include "sonic-4.net" and will use it as the folder into which to move the other (renamed) pop.xxx.net folders.

I thought you wanted to move all your mail to the onemain.com? I don't see the point in first moving them to sonic-4.net if you're eventually going to be moving them to onemain.com!

I tried to address this above. It seems to me that the mail should all be in the user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory" since it is listed in pref.js.

baumgrenze wrote:Please confirm that MozBackup is sufficient protection and I will take the remaining steps.

It does seem that, except for the Local Folders, MozBackup will be sufficient protection.
Regards,

Dave.


On 3/7/19 you said:

4. Rename these folders (as long as there are no existing files with these names in pop.onemain.com), as follows:
Local Folders to Local Mail, to distinguish it from the Local Folders in pop.onemain.com, pop.sonic-2.net to pop-sonic-2

I carefully examined all of the pop.*.com/net folders and found no Local Folders in them. Does that mean that your concern about distinguishing various Local Folders entries does not really apply to what I want to accomplish?


As for deleting the *.msf files in the folders that will be copied/moved, that should be simple in ZTreeWin since I can set the display file spec to *.msf and they will stand out.

I hope I've not forgotten any other questions. It has been another fragmented day.

Thanks again for helping me see my way forward,
Thanks,

Baumgrenze

amrad
 
Posts: 2282
Joined: May 29th, 2004, 9:01 pm
Location: UK

Post Posted March 13th, 2019, 1:27 pm

Hello Baumgrenze,

You don't /have/ to use either MozBackup or ZTreeWin to back-up your profile. The simplest way is to copy the Mozilla folder to another location on your PC's hard drive or removable storage, e.g. a DVD or pen drive. You are, of course, entitled to do it in whatever manner suits you.

baumgrenze wrote:The prefs.js lines that I quoted above tell me that pop.sonic-4.net is where the mail client will look to download new mail from Sonic's server.

Yes, that is to where mail would be downloaded using the current set-up.

baumgrenze wrote:That is why I suggested that pop.sonic-4.net is the folder into which other pop.mail folders should be 'copied'.

You can change things so that you get a profile and a 'prefs.js' file which contains only one account. Assuming your current ISP is 'sonic', it would be 'pop.sonic.net'.

Once you have all your mail satisfactorily copied to the same profile (pop.sonic-4.net), so that no mail exists outside that profile, you would then delete all the other 'sonic', 'onemail' and 'earthlink' folders, and rename 'pop.sonic-4.net' to 'pop.sonic.net'. In the prefs.js file, there will be entries for those folders, which would need removing, you could do that by manually editing the 'prefs.js' file but it would be easier and safer to let SeaMonkey do it for you!

To do that, with SeaMonkey closed, you would need to /move/ the folder 'xxxxxxxx.default' to a location that SeaMonkey won't access, and delete the mozilla folder. Then uninstall SeaMonkey and reinstall SeaMonkey. This will create a new profile which will have only one mail account in the prefs.js file when you have set-up SeaMonkey Mail for 'pop.sonic.net'. The new profile will have a folder named xxxxxxxx.default, where xxxxxxxx is a random 8 character string, which can contain upper and lower case letters and numbers. Make a note of that 8 character string, you will need it.

With SeaMonkey closed, rename with the xxxxxxx.default from the new profile the 'xxxxxxxx.default folder that you previously moved, and move it back to the mozilla folder that was created in the new profile. If you then start SeaMonkey, you should find that it now has only one 'sonic' folder under the 'xxxxxxxx.default folder and all your mail will be in it.

baumgrenze wrote:You used the word, 'copy' on 3/7/19. Did you mean I should leave a copy of the pop.mail folders where they are and also place a copy in the folder that prefs.js designates as the current place for mail?

The reason I said 'copy' was so that if anything went wrong, you would still have the original with which to try again. Once the process of arranging your mail is completed, you would then delete the originals.


amrad wrote:As for Local Folders being above the pop.***.net entries in Windows Explorer, that has no significance as to where the Local Folders appear in SeaMonkey.

I think the reason is because the files in Windows Explorer are arranged alphabetically but not in SeaMonkey for the generated/system files.

baumgrenze wrote:I will adjust your 07 Mar 2019 instructions modified to include "sonic-4.net" and will use it as the folder into which to move the other (renamed) pop.xxx.net folders.
I tried to address this above. It seems to me that the mail should all be in the user_pref("mail.server.server2.directory" since it is listed in pref.js.

See above!

baumgrenze wrote:On 3/7/19 you said:

4. Rename these folders (as long as there are no existing files with these names in pop.onemain.com), as follows:
Local Folders to Local Mail, to distinguish it from the Local Folders in pop.onemain.com, pop.sonic-2.net to pop-sonic-2

I carefully examined all of the pop.*.com/net folders and found no Local Folders in them. Does that mean that your concern about distinguishing various Local Folders entries does not really apply to what I want to accomplish?

What I meant, was so you could see which was the Local Folders (renamed Local Mail) that you had moved from other accounts compared to the Local folders that already existed in that account.

baumgrenze wrote:As for deleting the *.msf files in the folders that will be copied/moved, that should be simple in ZTreeWin since I can set the display file spec to *.msf and they will stand out.

In WIndows Explorer, if you click the 'Type' heading, it will change the order of the files so that they are in alphabetical order, either ascending or descending, so all the .msf files will be together in one block you can click on the first .msf file and, whilst holding down the shift key, click on the last, this will highlight them all which can then be deleted by right clicking anywhere in the block and selecting delete from the pop-up list!

baumgrenze wrote:Thanks again for helping me see my way forward,

You're welcome.

Regards,

Dave.

amrad
 
Posts: 2282
Joined: May 29th, 2004, 9:01 pm
Location: UK

Post Posted March 13th, 2019, 8:09 pm

Hello Baumgrenze,

In my last message, I wrote:

With SeaMonkey closed, rename with the xxxxxxx.default from the 'new' profile the xxxxxxxx.default folder that you previously moved, and move it back to the mozilla folder that was created in the 'new' profile. If you then start SeaMonkey, you should find that it now has only one 'sonic' folder under the xxxxxxxx.default folder and all your mail will be in it.

I should have written this:

1. With SeaMonkey closed, rename with the xxxxxxx.default from the 'new' Profile (which will not have any mail in it at this time) the xxxxxxxx.default folder that you previously moved, and has all your mail in it.
2. Delete the 'new' xxxxxxx.default folder.
3. Move the renamed xxxxxxxx.default folder (that has all your mail in it) to the Profile folder that was created in the 'new' Profile.

If you then start SeaMonkey, you should find that it now has only one 'sonic' folder (pop.sonic.net) under the renamed xxxxxxxx.default folder and all your mail will be in it. In 'prefs.js', there will be only one 'pop.sonic.net' entry.

Regards,

Dave.

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