Advertisement in the official FF 1.0 de-DE! Officially? Why?

Discussion of general topics about Mozilla Firefox
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KrisM2
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Post by KrisM2 »

ditto
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tombik
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Post by tombik »

The dream is over :(
Dunderklumpen
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Post by Dunderklumpen »

No, the dream is not over.

Any extensions that tracks the users surfing habits, that gathers information should be clearly marked as such - about the same way that download.com warns their visitors.
I have no problem with the fact that the Mozilla Foundation is making money out of some search plug-ins/extensions. I do however have a problem if the official sites links that type of
extensions - without any information. I have an even bigger problem if searchengines are included (with redirects) in the software itself to adware-sites or sites that gathers information/tracks users.

You see - I actually trust Mozilla - and I would very much like to continue to do so.

Since much of the work depends on volunteers - a clear policy should be made (yes I know am nagging) on this. It should be clear on how this type of issues should be handled in the future because the problem will not go away - it will most likely become a more serious one as Mozilla keeps on getting more and more attention and more and more new users.
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rfrangioni77
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Post by rfrangioni77 »

tombik wrote:The dream is over :(


Oh, for crying out loud, THIS is exactly the kind of sensationalized, chicken little horseshit we all need to avoid right now.

Sorry, but these kinds of doomsday predictions irk the hell out of me. We don't even know the whole story yet, for God's sake. :furious:
danny_w
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Post by danny_w »

We know enough however to know that if they don't put a lid on it very quickly it is about to get out of hand, and then where will we be? Mozilla is very much apt to lose all of the good will that they have gained recently with the official release and record downloads. Mozilla, where do you stand on this? We (and the rest of the world) need to know NOW!
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Umko
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Post by Umko »

danny_w wrote:We know enough however to know that if they don't put a lid on it very quickly it is about to get out of hand, and then where will we be? Mozilla is very much apt to lose all of the good will that they have gained recently with the official release and record downloads. Mozilla, where do you stand on this? We (and the rest of the world) need to know NOW!


yes indeed!
it is not so bad as long as the mozilla foundation tackle the case in the right way and learn from it as well. it is not a good idea to get too excited about it, but the problem is there and has to be solved as soon as possible.

i expect a good thorough explanation and some specific steps to get things right. and then things will be fine again.
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technomage
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Post by technomage »

Gott wrote:This article might be quite interesting in this context:

Firefox fortune hunters @ c|net News.com

For example on page 3:

"These people are in demand," said Walt Scacchi, a research scientist at the University of California at Irvine's Institute for Software Research who studies the open-source world. "As Mozilla is moving into a wider public audience, software developers who are identified as core contributors are likely to have market opportunities that conventional software developers would not have. If you've contributed to a software system used by millions of people, you've demonstrated something that most software developers have not done."

Those core contributors can expect between 5 percent and 15 percent more in salary compensation than the average software developer, Scacchi said.

Mozilla Foundation representatives declined to be interviewed, but issued a statement stressing the not-for-profit nature of the foundation and its work.

"As to commercial opportunities in general, a number of us at the Mozilla Foundation have heard a range of discussion about how one might make money out of open source in general and Mozilla Firefox in particular," said Mitchell Baker, president of the Mozilla Foundation. "The focus of the Mozilla Foundation, as a nonprofit organization, is on our product, providing a good user experience and fulfilling our core mission of promoting choice and innovation on the Net."



Redirecting searches, data-mining, tracking cookies, rendering a searchplugin useless if an add-filter is used ... all of this behind the users back ...
all this is opposing a "good user experience" IMHO and is not really that non-profit.

a) If you don't like it, you can uninstall the offending ebay plugin and install a different one from mycroft, so it's not some horrible permanent blight.

b) Data mining is, IMO, pretty damn low on the list of "things that ruin my good user experience." Yes, it is on the list. But nowhere near the top. And did I mention point "a"??

c) EARNING MONEY AND HAVING A SURPLUS OF FUNDS DOES NOT MAKE YOU A "FOR PROFIT" COMPANY!! Try googling "not for profit" and see what the definition is.
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Gingerbread_Man
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Post by Gingerbread_Man »

danny_w wrote:Mozilla, where do you stand on this? We (and the rest of the world) need to know NOW!


Hold your horses. It's 1 AM in Germany right now. The statement is supposed to be out today.
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_hb_
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Post by _hb_ »

tombik wrote:The dream is over :(


AxelHecht wrote:Wie auf https://update.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?application=firefox&id=366&vid=1162 zu sehen ist, haben sich die Sorgen um die A9 toolbar rumgesprochen. Sie ist wieder runtergeflogen.


short translation : "A9 Toolbar" is wiped from the mozilla.org .

thumbs up !

So the "dream" is NOT over.

This was quite a quick reaction. I think they are now enough sensibilised to that kind of things ( plugins, extensions ).

Now let's calm down and wait. I think there will follow some ( internal ) discussion, some statements .. and hopefully all will go well.
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Gingerbread_Man
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Post by Gingerbread_Man »

_hb_ wrote:short translation : "A9 Toolbar" is wiped from the mozilla.org .


It looks like it's true! I can't find it anymore. Awesome! \:D/ What bothered me most is that it was listed as the #1 reason to upgrade to Firefox 1.0 on this sticky. Hopefully, they will edit it soon.

Privacy 1 - Spyware 0 :biggrin:
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A.Topal
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Post by A.Topal »

Just to clear out one thing, before the official statement is out: Mozilla Firefox even in the german version has had never practised data mining and it never will -At least as long as I'm responsible for the german version. The only collected data was, how often the searchbar got used. And even that isn't done anymore. We allowed ebay to use one of his partners for this task and that was wrong. We already appologized for that in the german forums and an official statement will follow.

We know about the senisibility of this topic, but to some of the german posters here: would you please be kind enough to recognize the statements in the german forums before posting your already answered questions here? That would help us a lot. Thanks.

Regards
Abdulkadir Topal
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Gingerbread_Man
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Post by Gingerbread_Man »

Posting at 3 AM on a weekday? I guess you can't sleep either. :sleeping:

The problem is that many publications, bloggers and such do not distinguish between "Firefox was datamining" and "an eBay partner was datamining." All they see is their search going to a site they do not know, something that doesn't happen when they search directly on eBay. They can't know what data is being collected; they have to trust you. And that trust is broken the moment you redirect to a third party site--whether it was at eBay's urging or not.

As long as this is recognized as a mistake in an official statement, I am confident Firefox's reputation will survive :) Best of luck.
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esavior
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Post by esavior »

A.Topal wrote:Just to clear out one thing, before the official statement is out: Mozilla Firefox even in the german version has had never practised data mining and it never will -At least as long as I'm responsible for the german version. The only collected data was, how often the searchbar got used. And even that isn't done anymore. We allowed ebay to use one of his partners for this task and that was wrong. We already appologized for that in the german forums and an official statement will follow.

We know about the senisibility of this topic, but to some of the german posters here: would you please be kind enough to recognize the statements in the german forums before posting your already answered questions here? That would help us a lot. Thanks.

Regards
Abdulkadir Topal

Have you been following this post? If your going to be here for awhile would you answer some questions for me. As you can see earlier in the post I really have made a effort to find out whats going on despite not speaking german. Heres my questions for you...

>Did you expect such a negative reaction?
>I am confused on what you mean about data mining, I believe what people are mostly concerned about is the redirect to mediaplex not what webtip was doing. Mediaplex is infact in the business of datamining for ad generation. If someone were to say that mozilla having a contract with a company that required them to pipe their users through a company with such a reputation, even though mozilla did not mine the data themselves, they are still benefiting from data mining, how would you respond?
>Why wasnt the community informed, I believe someone asked this on the german forums and axel pointed to a localization bug; but this seems like a significant enough change for atleast a post or a note somewhere on the site pre launch?
>Why did axel wish this thread to be locked?
>How will the mozilla foundation treat such contracts ideas in the future?
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sergio eduardo
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Post by sergio eduardo »

Mr. Topal , Mozilla's reputation will survive your mistake but I do hope the official statement is a clear and honest appraisal of it . Did your group expected it not to be noticed ? Can you imagine all of this blowing up 6 months down the track Mr. Topal ! It all seems to be of minor importance to you and yes , data mining took place while you were in charge . Apologies , I am sorry to say , will not ring true to me .
Mr. Topal , no matter how polite your words were when referring to the germans posting here I can see your hostility towards them . As a matter of fact you should humbly apologize and thank them for bringing the matter to our attention . I am interestered in the development of the crisis and I do not read german .
Mr. Topal , this is not a storm in a tea cup either . I trust Mozilla sir but I am afraid this sentiment does not apply to the ones responsible for this debacle .
yours sergio
Last edited by sergio eduardo on November 19th, 2004, 5:09 am, edited 2 times in total.
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esavior
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Post by esavior »

Mr. Topal , Mozilla's reputation will survive your mistake but I do hope the official statement is a clear and honest appraisal of it .

And have a official translation into english :banana:
Mindjunk
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