Advertisement in the official FF 1.0 de-DE! Officially? Why?

Discussion of general topics about Mozilla Firefox
Locked
User avatar
sergio eduardo
Folder@Home
Posts: 5170
Joined: May 12th, 2004, 1:08 pm
Location: Narrawallee - Australia

Post by sergio eduardo »

Ditto
User avatar
Gingerbread_Man
Posts: 470
Joined: October 5th, 2004, 6:28 pm

Post by Gingerbread_Man »

hotel porkpie wrote:Sounds familiar. Just the usual politician patter.


Being apolitical, I am almost offended by that statement.

hotel porkpie wrote:Split any hairs you like trying to defend it


I see a difference between Mozilla Europe and the headquarters. If you choose not to, have it your way. At this time, we don't know exactly what Moz Germany was thinking, and if the introduction of the infamous search plugin was made with headquarters' blessing.

hotel porkpie wrote:Next time some Mozilla mandarin pontificates about spyware, will anyone be able to take him seriously?


The short answer is YES.

Since it will be a while before an official statement is made and this conversation seems to be on the brink of becoming a flame, I will refrain from posting for the time being. I've made my point, you didn't agree with it; we can call it a stalemate.
Gingerbread Man's posts, 2004-10-06 through 2005-08-12.
User avatar
rfrangioni77
Posts: 1510
Joined: January 5th, 2004, 1:48 am
Location: Bumdumbourge, near Totalslava
Contact:

Post by rfrangioni77 »

sergio eduardo wrote:It was a clear cut decision coming from the top management of Mozilla Foundation.


I missed this little tidbit of information, apparently...where did you see this?
danny_w
Posts: 73
Joined: November 10th, 2004, 8:33 am

Post by danny_w »

Wasn't it admitted that this was a local "experiment"? It seems to me that if this hadn't been caught when it was that this practice may have become world-wide. If they have dabbled in this "experiment" and got caught, I'm not so sure that everybody will be willing to trust that they won't try it again (just as an "experiment").
User avatar
sergio eduardo
Folder@Home
Posts: 5170
Joined: May 12th, 2004, 1:08 pm
Location: Narrawallee - Australia

Post by sergio eduardo »

You are right rfrangioni , I might have been presumptious on that statement and I am sorry to have inflamed people like hotel porkpie . I just can't imagine something like this to go unnoticed/ unquestioned as to the wiseness of its implementation . The overall picture seems to point that way .
It makes no difference to me as I will always use Firefox though , regardless ...
User avatar
rfrangioni77
Posts: 1510
Joined: January 5th, 2004, 1:48 am
Location: Bumdumbourge, near Totalslava
Contact:

Post by rfrangioni77 »

sergio eduardo wrote:You are right rfrangioni , I might have been presumptious on that statement and I am sorry to have inflamed people like hotel porkpie


There's no need to apologize, sergio...it's all good. I was honestly curious as to the source of that...in all these pages, I was wondering if I had missed it somehow. =)

And don't even worry about "inflaming" people like porkpie....he just registered here today to bitch and whine and moan aimlessly because he heard on the 1nt4rw3b that Firefox was spying, and he figured he'd take his half-cocked information here so he could have a bit of fun tonight, maybe troll for a nice argument, and make himself look cool in the process. He's not worth even a second's worth of concern.

sergio eduardo wrote:I just can't imagine something like this to go unnoticed/ unquestioned as to the wiseness of its implementation . The overall picture seems to point that way .


I can certainly see how it could go unnoticed...Mozilla doesn't have a big "campus" like Redmond. Everyone involved in the localizations aren't in the same room, or even the same country...hell, they are even on the same <i>continent</i>. It's very possible that nobody knew about MozEurope's little "experiment". I'll be disappointed if everyone DID know and allowed it to continue, but nothing points to that right now.
This post has been scanned with Edgarware™
Lost User 36785
Posts: 0
Joined: December 31st, 1969, 5:00 pm

Post by Lost User 36785 »

Ok, frangioni, I've got to ask...what the hell is Edgarware? You had to have just changed your signature within the last hour. :)
User avatar
rfrangioni77
Posts: 1510
Joined: January 5th, 2004, 1:48 am
Location: Bumdumbourge, near Totalslava
Contact:

Post by rfrangioni77 »

rreed wrote:Ok, frangioni, I've got to ask...what the hell is Edgarware? You had to have just changed your signature within the last hour. :)


http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail118.html

=)
User avatar
esavior
Posts: 1211
Joined: July 29th, 2003, 1:57 pm
Contact:

Post by esavior »

rfrangioni77 wrote:
sergio eduardo wrote:It was a clear cut decision coming from the top management of Mozilla Foundation.


I missed this little tidbit of information, apparently...where did you see this?

Well as I said earlier in this thread Michell Baker said in her blog post about the Firefox 1.0 release
We provide access to search services from a range of sources including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, eBay and others you can see in Firefox. We expect to see some funds come to the Foundation as a result of our integrated search. We'll use any funds that result to help support the Mozilla Foundation's non-profit operations. When finances are involved questions often arise about their influence on an organization and we'll spend some time talking about this as we go forward.
(link)
that would seem to indicate that the foundation was most definatly aware of the change.
Mindjunk
I didn't hear no bell...
User avatar
Umko
Posts: 95
Joined: June 18th, 2004, 11:52 am
Location: Europe

Post by Umko »

indeed, and that is why i think it is wrong to consider this only a firefox germany issue.

this is a mozilla foundation policy issue, and it would be great if we get more detailed information on what the whole thing is about.
hotel porkpie
Posts: 16
Joined: November 20th, 2004, 6:22 pm

Post by hotel porkpie »

Umko wrote:indeed, and that is why i think it is wrong to consider this only a firefox germany issue.

this is a mozilla foundation policy issue, and it would be great if we get more detailed information on what the whole thing is about.


exactly right. The organisation have had more than enough time to put together its statement, but it hasn't, and what's the betting it ever will? The attitude of Mozilla is clear from that shifty little intervention at the beginning of this thread: they'd prefer to cover this up as far as they can, contain the furore to Germany and German-language speakers and hope the rest of the firefox community never gets wind of it.

It's been a dishonest, underhand policy all along and now it's being handled in a dishonest, underhand way with cack-handed grubby cover-ups. What are we supposed to think of an organisation behaving with such sneaking hypocrisy?
Justsayno
Posts: 52
Joined: November 19th, 2004, 9:59 am

Post by Justsayno »

Ok, some here are missing The Big Picture, This apparent "mistake" was found, and eliminated a little over a week after release. <b>A Week people!</b>

Isn't that one of the advantages of open-source development? It has been found by the community and removed. If this was a MS release we would all be stumbling on in complete ignorance. (Hardly a stretch for some here!)

This should be proof that the system is working, not cause for a total meltdown! Personally I feel much better knowing what is going on than using software that I have no idea what it's doing with my information. Anyone who goes back to using IE based just on this episode is a hypocrite, in my opinion.

"They found that Ff was sending info to a third party, so I'm going back to a browser that I have <b>No Idea</b> where my info is being sent"?????????????
User avatar
rfrangioni77
Posts: 1510
Joined: January 5th, 2004, 1:48 am
Location: Bumdumbourge, near Totalslava
Contact:

Post by rfrangioni77 »

esavior wrote:Well as I said earlier in this thread Michell Baker said in her blog post about the Firefox 1.0 release
We provide access to search services from a range of sources including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, eBay and others you can see in Firefox. We expect to see some funds come to the Foundation as a result of our integrated search. We'll use any funds that result to help support the Mozilla Foundation's non-profit operations. When finances are involved questions often arise about their influence on an organization and we'll spend some time talking about this as we go forward.
(link)
that would seem to indicate that the foundation was most definatly aware of the change.


That doesn't say <i>anything</i> about the <u>ebay.de redirect</u>....it simply says that the orgainization plans on bringing in some money with integrated search. That can be done without the means of a redirect to a data miner, like the ebay.de fiasco.

That doesn't indicate the organization was <i>aware</i> of this situation. It can be <i>inferred</i> that they are, but nothing in that statement should be conclusively declared as an admission of knowledge of the decision to use the different ebay search in the German version.

I'm not saying that it isn'ta possibility. All I'm saying it we should be careful about jumping to conclusions and reading more into statements than are actually there. The fact that it was ONLY in the German version, which is a localized version translated by a team other than the core dev team, and the offending search plugin was not in any other versions, localized or otherwise, speaks volumes...no way we should discount that fact and assume they knew about it based on that and the vague statement you linked to above. It's just not conclusive, and we shouldn't be accusing based on it.

hotel porkpie wrote:What are we supposed to think of an organisation behaving with such sneaking hypocrisy?


You <i>can</i> leave, you know.

Nobody's holding you here, and I'm gonna go out on a limb and say nobody's gonna miss you, either. We're all perfectly capable of making our own decisions about the situation without your uninformed, liberal-media-style sensationalism clouding the issue.

Rather than listen to your aimless, childish blathering, whose sole purpose is to simply inflame the situation way beyond what it needs to be, I'd rather wait and see what comes of it and then make an informed decision.
danny_w
Posts: 73
Joined: November 10th, 2004, 8:33 am

Post by danny_w »

Perhaps they didn't know, but they certainly opened themselves up to the possibility by accepting money. Anytime money is involved, there is a real chance for this type of thing "sneaking in". I personally wish that they had never opened the door.
User avatar
rfrangioni77
Posts: 1510
Joined: January 5th, 2004, 1:48 am
Location: Bumdumbourge, near Totalslava
Contact:

Post by rfrangioni77 »

danny_w wrote:Perhaps they didn't know, but they certainly opened themselves up to the possibility by accepting money. Anytime money is involved, there is a real chance for this type of thing "sneaking in". I personally wish that they had never opened the door.


In an open-source utopia, they wouldn't have to...users would donate enough to keep the foundation running. Unfortunately, I seriously doubt they can get by on donations alone.

They <i>money</i> to function. They </i>need</i> money for more bandwidth to appease the whiners that came out of the woodwork when the bandwidth crunch hit on 1.0 release day...and there ARE ways to make money with the integrated search functions <i>without</i> using redirects to data miners like the one that was found in the German version...I still don't believe the foundation knew about this redirect per se, but we'll see eventually. *shrug*

All I'm saying is, we need to stop jumping to conclusions and inferring shenaigans from vague blog posts and for God's sake, we really, really, REALLY need to stop the sensationalizing. This ain't the end of civilization as we know it, people.
Locked