Googlebar as standard (lite, standard + full installations)

jrobbio · Post by **jrobbio** » June 28th, 2003, 1:10 pm

For those that don't know, it is possible to get the google toolbar known as Googlebar ( http://googlebar.mozdev.org/ without pagerank) for mozilla and firebird. The firebird-googlebar combination really makes the browsing experience for me complete and it really makes me realise what I was missing out on.

I wanted to see if people agreed with me on suggesting it as a default addition to the basic firebird download since it is 9th in the mozdev top 50 projects.

Rob

asquithea · Post by **asquithea** » June 28th, 2003, 1:14 pm

Not sure that I do. It's certainly an excellent extension, but I've seen it clash with some themes, and there's already some simple search functionality built into the UI.

IMO, a better approach would be to go along the lines of multiple installers (Lite, Standard and Full), and include it in the Full Installer. T'would also be good if Google could be persuaded to pimp it on the basis of sniffed user agent.

MagicT · Post by **MagicT** » June 28th, 2003, 1:53 pm

I disagree. I've tried Googlebar and it doesn't add anything to my browsing experience except bloat to my screen real estate. People simply have different tastes there are a lot of people that would say there are better things to add to a standard download than the Googlebar. Besides, The Googlebar is easy to download, so...

On the other hand, I can see the perspective of a Lite, Standard and Full installation. It would give newbies who don't know which are the most useful extensions, and don't want to go to discussion groups like this to find(they just want a browser, not a life

), a chance to try out some extensions.

jrobbio · Post by **jrobbio** » June 28th, 2003, 1:57 pm

I would agree with that asquithea since the googlebar defeats the point of the simple UI available by default.

At 6.6mb Firebird is pretty slim and I'm sure people would accept to go up 10mb without questioning it as a full install.

Rob

Post by **alanjstr** » June 28th, 2003, 2:38 pm

There is a reason why they didn't include it in the core. Extensions <i>extend</i>. The regular search box is more than enough for me.

jrobbio · Post by **jrobbio** » June 28th, 2003, 3:12 pm

I think more than anything, what I'm trying to point out is that the masses are not going to go searching to somewhere like mozdev or here just to get an extension they might like.
If Firebird is ever going to become mainstream (and I believe it will), a decent majority are going to request for these things to be readily available at a couple of clicks.
It may seem really straight forward for many of you who are the elite of the developing web, but have you ever tried teaching someone with very little technical know how to install something as simple as that.

Anyway, point taken.

Rob

MoNkaholic · Post by **MoNkaholic** » June 28th, 2003, 3:16 pm

I don't think anybody wants to go down the road of including extensions by default using popularity as the sole indicator of what merits inclusion. Though when an official installer is released, having a custom install that gives you the option to choose from a number of "official" extensions thuroughly tested with that particular milestone might be a nice idea.

I wonder if it would be possible for Mozilla.org to host said "official" extensions, and have the installer download and apply your choices during the install procedure.

Post by **alanjstr** » June 28th, 2003, 3:25 pm

Oh, you want an easy place to find extensions?

http://extensionroom.mozdev.org/
http://texturizer.net/firebird/extensions.html

Wow, that was incredibly difficult. Perhaps the EM extension will be included and that will make finding extensions easier. But how hard is it to visit those two websites?

Asa mentioned that there might be some extensions considered for the installer, but that was quite a while ago and the installer still hasn't appeared.

jrobbio · Post by **jrobbio** » June 28th, 2003, 3:33 pm

Alan stop thinking like a Tech wizz and try putting yourelf into the mind of a relative newbie to the net. Most net savvy people will not have a problem understanding and locating extensions, but there are people out there that don't even know what an extension to a browser is.
Perhaps something like the EM extension is a step forward to the solution.

Rob

MoNkaholic · Post by **MoNkaholic** » June 28th, 2003, 3:42 pm

alanjstr wrote:Asa mentioned that there might be some extensions considered for the installer, but that was quite a while ago and the installer still hasn't appeared.

I'm basically working under the assumption that the installer will be out the door at least by the time some incarnation of Mozilla 1.5 is released.

Post by **tve** » June 28th, 2003, 3:43 pm

jrobbio wrote:Perhaps something like the EM extension is a step forward to the solution.

Indeed it is, and we'll surely have an easier way to install extensions once we're out of alpha/beta stage... And with some fine-tuning, EM looks like a great solution.

But bundling extensions with the default build is the wrong way - and somehow also destroys the whole concept of "extensions" ;)

Post by **alanjstr** » June 28th, 2003, 4:34 pm

jrobbio wrote: there are people out there that don't even know what an extension to a browser is.

And those are the people that don't need a whole toolbar just for google, or mouse gestures, or most of the 60+ extensions that exist. Firebird provides something simple and easy to use.

jrobbio · Post by **jrobbio** » June 28th, 2003, 5:05 pm

Fair point Alan. As for bundling, instead maybe just having the browser "know" about the many extensions instead rather than having to go look for them. Just an idea.

Rob

jbs3645 · Post by **jbs3645** » June 28th, 2003, 5:53 pm

I, for one, have had the experience of showing someone something about Firebird. My son and his wife have the total knowledge that there is in fact a "web" and that they can find things on it . They were using straight microsoft (browser, web site, isp etc). Finally got them away from that stuff. I go over and install Mozilla and they loved it. I have since put firebird on it. I set it up for them to use. KISS applies. That is why I love firebird. Simple and straight forward without a lot of useless junk added on. (By the way, I am not a programmer nor do I know how. I am self taught on the computer and internet. My age is 60 on this monday.) I add on what I want and what they want. PLEASE (yes, I am screaming) Keep It Simple. Let me decide what I want and not someone else! I use the URL bar, type in what I am looking for, and get a google page listing everything, what do I need with any other bars or whatever.

Post by **alanjstr** » June 28th, 2003, 6:03 pm

Just because I can't find a better place to use it right now, I think Phil did a good job of describing it in <a href="http://philringnalda.com/blog/2003/06/firebird_extensions.php">his blog</a>

phil ringnalda wrote:Firebird is built to be extended. That was one of the main design goals, growing out of the way the bloated Mozilla application suite had turned into "every feature anyone has ever thought of, with a preference to turn it off, and thirty prefs to change how it works." Extending it, or making major changes in how it looks and acts, is surprisingly easy (for some value of easy, at least).

Don't get me wrong: Firebird by itself is a wonderful browser. Just the standard tabbed browsing, so you can easily switch between several different web pages without the distracting context switch of changing entire windows, and "Bookmark all tabs in a folder" plus "Open in tabs" in bookmark groups will make a huge difference in the way you use the web. But adding extensions (which is as simple as clicking a link, then an OK button or three, and restarting the browser) gives you the added features that not everyone needs, but that will save tons of aggrevation for people like us who live on the web.