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Pale Moon has changed its GUID.

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smsmith
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Post Posted October 21st, 2014, 7:47 pm

Frank Lion wrote:Now, I'm not sure what TLS 1.1/1.2, graphical tab switching is all about, but I do remember thinking at the time, 'This guy making a browser or a theme on top of a browser?' So yeah, add me to the list of the 'terribly uninformed '.

Forgive me if I've taken too much out of the context in my snipped quote, Frank.

The "graphical tab switching" is merely the Fx 4 era preference browser.allTabs.previews toggled to true. Can't recall when the code was removed from Firefox, but the preference does nothing now, especially since there is no permanent all tabs button. That code would have needed to be put back in somehow.

Here's a simple explanation for the colored icons in the toolbar (which you know all about what with the cool SVG masks you and Patrick discussed a while back): https://userstyles.org/styles/101231/co ... ox-buttons

Firefox doesn't directly expose the security protocols in the options, so I don't know if it's simply flipping a preference for whatever he's banging on about in relation to TLS 1.1/1.2.

I would like to know what is meant by "custom standalone image background color".
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Post Posted October 21st, 2014, 7:50 pm

LoudNoise wrote:Assuming that they haven't moved to the 31 source <snip>

Well, this bug was fixed in Fx 31, but still broken in PM 25.0.1, so how much of Fx 31 could be in there?
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=911409

I know it's a cherry picked example, but it's been fixed for the last three Fx releases (31, 32 and 33).
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Post Posted October 21st, 2014, 10:35 pm

I think the All-tabs stuff is actually Firefox 3.5 era and simply never got turned on. That was a Faaborg design!

smsmith wrote:Here's a simple explanation for the colored icons in the toolbar (which you know all about what with the cool SVG masks you and Patrick discussed a while back): https://userstyles.org/styles/101231/co ... ox-buttons


Man, I love it when people put their Copyright on my work and don't even give me credit. Swell. :P

smsmith wrote:I would like to know what is meant by "custom standalone image background color".


It means when you right-click "view image" instead of seeing the dappled dark grey background color, you see some other color. Personally, I've tried just about every iteration of this there is and haven't come up with a really satisfactory fix for this that works 100% of the time.
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Post Posted October 21st, 2014, 10:52 pm

^^ At the moment, both seem to focused on the injustice of it all. Matt is trying to make a new ABP fitted for the revelation and Moony is feverishly working to make sure that every site sees Palemood as Firefox. That leaves little time for simple maintenance.
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 11:26 am

smsmith wrote:The "graphical tab switching" is merely the Fx 4 era preference browser.allTabs.previews toggled to true.

Ah, thanks. That's Dao-G's Control Tab extension stuff. It had been an extension for a while and Dao wanted to slip it into default, without full tab testing/impact (*cough* I got it blocked from Release via the Belt, for that reason) After mucho testing it made it in and although better, I thought, than Tab 'Panorama Damp Squib' Groups, it never really caught on and was finally dropped out.

See how much better my explanations are when I actually understand what is being talked about? :P

I would like to know what is meant by "custom standalone image background color"

That's just resource://gre/res/TopLevelImageDocument.css that controls the background, borders, position of images in 'View Image' mode.

Takes around 12 lines to style that lot usually and then, if you want to do the custom bit, just throw the color-picker coding at it.

Not sure how the subject of SVG filters sprang up, but I am sure that there is only one person to thank for seeing that stuff around these days (that includes, not just the coloured stuff but also my fancy glow hover/active state effects on the toolbar buttons of the Tigers and the 2 recent SeaMonkey themes of mine) and that is the guy who started this thread - viewtopic.php?p=12212123#p12212123
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smsmith
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 2:29 pm

Frank Lion wrote:
smsmith wrote:
I would like to know what is meant by "custom standalone image background color"

That's just resource://gre/res/TopLevelImageDocument.css that controls the background, borders, position of images in 'View Image' mode.

Takes around 12 lines to style that lot usually and then, if you want to do the custom bit, just throw the color-picker coding at it.

Thanks for that. Sounds like a ton of work. :P

Not sure how the subject of SVG filters sprang up, but I am sure that there is only one person to thank for seeing that stuff around these days (that includes, not just the coloured stuff but also my fancy glow hover/active state effects on the toolbar buttons of the Tigers and the 2 recent SeaMonkey themes of mine) and that is the guy who started this thread - viewtopic.php?p=12212123#p12212123

I brought it up because of your "is he building a theme or a browser?" type comment. It's one of the things that makes Pale Moon Pale Moon.
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 7:30 pm

LuvKomputrs wrote:
patrickjdempsey wrote:Old code, not faster, websites possibly broken, extensions broken, developers aggressive with addons authors, and soon to be "eclipsed" by Firefox win64 releases. I cannot really imagine any reason at this point to even bother with it.

For further clarification:
I test a lot of browsers in order to give good recommendations to clients on which browsers to use and which ones to avoid for their companies and for their home use as well.



Can you post here if you check out Palemood? I am interested to see the user agent. I am wondering if they dropped "gecko".
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smsmith
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 7:44 pm

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:25.0) Gecko/20141013 PaleMoon/25.0.1
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 8:34 pm

Is that before or after Moony deciding that "lying about which browser you are using" was a good idea?
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 8:39 pm

I see the PM crowd are extolling that Firefox will drop to around 2% market share in a few years and become a niche browser again. They however fail to follow the logic and ask where this would leave an already niche browser relying on Firefox core code for security and other fixes?

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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 9:00 pm

I don't know why you guys discussed the thread so long time.
Anyhow, I think keeping the compatibility is the 3rd custom build's the first thing.

smsmith
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 9:06 pm

LoudNoise wrote:Is that before or after Moony deciding that "lying about which browser you are using" was a good idea?

Yeah, not sure when/if that change was made and I'm not about to go and track down PM 25.0 to see what the UA was then.

Here's the UA from a previous post:
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:25.0) Gecko/20141005 PaleMoon/25.0.0

Current (25.0.1):
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:25.0) Gecko/20141013 PaleMoon/25.0.1
Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he eats for a lifetime.
I like poetry, long walks on the beach and poking dead things with a stick.
Please do not PM me for personal support. Keep posts here in the Forums instead and we all learn.

LoudNoise
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 9:16 pm

xunxun1982 wrote:I don't know why you guys discussed the thread so long time.
.



Mainly because the Palemood folks have a recent rich history of being a pain in Firefox support and extension threads. Keeping them involved and letting them have free rein here means that we don't have problems with them in the Firefox, SeaMonkey or Extension/Theme Release threads. Fairly straight forward moderation.

Besides, it is fun :).
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LoudNoise
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Post Posted October 22nd, 2014, 9:21 pm

smsmith wrote:
LoudNoise wrote:Is that before or after Moony deciding that "lying about which browser you are using" was a good idea?

Yeah, not sure when/if that change was made and I'm not about to go and track down PM 25.0 to see what the UA was then.

Here's the UA from a previous post:
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:25.0) Gecko/20141005 PaleMoon/25.0.0

Current (25.0.1):
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:25.0) Gecko/20141013 PaleMoon/25.0.1


So I think we can assume that the public UA browser sniffing wasn't the issue here.
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Frank Lion

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Post Posted October 23rd, 2014, 5:05 am

smsmith wrote:I brought it up because of your "is he building a theme or a browser?" type comment. It's one of the things that makes Pale Moon Pale Moon.


It's an interesting question.

I can see, and indeed would encourage, the need for faster, lighter 3rd party builds of Firefox and there is a lot of validity in doing so. In other words, those are very worthwhile projects.

What I have trouble with is the concept that some vast amount of work, to the point of a complete fork, needs to happen just to make Australis look and feel like, say, Firefox 24.

For example - viewtopic.php?p=13492625#p13492625

Do people realise that there is nothing on that 'Locked' and 'Removed' list that cannot be reverted with just one theme and one extension? Nothing on that 'Added' list that cannot be hidden by the same?

This is one of those chicken and the egg type things. People have assumed that because CTR is really complicated, that this whole stuff is really complicated, but CTR is only really complicated because it offers so many options to the user and by its general approach. That is not a criticism, but an objective viewpoint.

So, if the sole object was just to make Australis look and feel like FF24 how would it be done? Well, there are already themes that can do most of it (add addons bar, flex spaces, spaces, move urlbar around, change the entire look, etc) and people should know by my userChrome.css stuff how easy it is to re-introduce things like icons+text and text only. The thing that people fret about - the tabs, is just not a problem, those tabs can be moved anywhere and are easy to style to look like anything you want.

But what of easily moving Forward, Back, Stop and Reload around? Err, it was done ages back - viewtopic.php?p=13545977#p13545977 and not just for default, but any theme. Look at the 2 pictures there - not only are Forward and Back flying all over the place, but have been separated again. No extension option stuff, just go into Customise and move them around, as of old. It just needed the concept of there being more than one way to do things to make that possible.

I suppose really what I'm saying about PM type stuff is this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tolb5BM6HEg

So Frank, if you can make Australis look and feel exactly like Firefox 24 will you do so? - What? For the 'glory', the non-existent donations? Do I really look that daft? There's a lot of things I can do, that doesn't mean I have to do them. Plus, glance at my UA string sometime. :)

No, the point I'm making is this - take Australis or one of the genuinely faster, lighter 3rd Party Builds of it and add 1 theme and 1 extension to it and you can have what looks and feels like Firefox 24 again. No GUID change, XP back, no addons changes, etc.

To regular users this stuff looks, I realise, really, really complicated, but sometimes looks can be deceiving - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWyCCJ6B2WE
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