MozillaZine

Changes in Firefox 57

Discussion about official Mozilla Firefox builds
ICQ5

User avatar
 
Posts: 1314
Joined: April 11th, 2014, 7:34 pm
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post Posted January 5th, 2017, 5:21 pm

Virtual_ManPL wrote:So basically in simple, Mozilla want to kill the most powerful weapon Firefox has now - the configurability, customization and possibility to change anything to look how users and extensions developers want.
It's very sad to hear this, especially when this change won't bring Firefox any more user base, it unfortunately probably be otherwise.

firefox has been losing its userbase for sometime so this isnt new, even more users are using Chrome in linux or a webkit/blink based browser anyway.

( sorry for using chrome as im in Sydney over holidays )

therube

User avatar
 
Posts: 17767
Joined: March 10th, 2004, 9:59 pm
Location: Maryland USA

Post Posted January 5th, 2017, 8:07 pm

(PBS News Hour this evening, & it reminded me of this thread, How employers kill worker motivation and what they can do to change. [Note the robots... as you start building the second one, i break this into pieces ... & then i say, would you like to build another one, the third one".] Third time's the charm. In this case, I'm afraid not.)
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.19) Gecko/20110420 SeaMonkey/2.0.14 Pinball CopyURL+ FetchTextURL FlashGot NoScript

marty60
 
Posts: 467
Joined: March 21st, 2012, 7:09 am

Post Posted January 5th, 2017, 10:07 pm

-Arch- wrote:firefox has been losing its userbase for sometime so this isnt new, even more users are using Chrome in linux or a webkit/blink based browser anyway.

The last four months or so Firefox has been making a steady comeback of sorts, going from its low of 7.69% in August to 12.22% currently. Most of that is at the expense of IE and not Chrome if the numbers are right. But it won't last since once XUL is gone so too will be the gains. Mozilla never learns.

https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser- ... imeframe=M

ICQ5

User avatar
 
Posts: 1314
Joined: April 11th, 2014, 7:34 pm
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post Posted January 6th, 2017, 2:41 pm

marty60 wrote:
-Arch- wrote:firefox has been losing its userbase for sometime so this isnt new, even more users are using Chrome in linux or a webkit/blink based browser anyway.

The last four months or so Firefox has been making a steady comeback of sorts, going from its low of 7.69% in August to 12.22% currently. Most of that is at the expense of IE and not Chrome if the numbers are right. But it won't last since once XUL is gone so too will be the gains. Mozilla never learns.

https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser- ... imeframe=M

i tend to think a lot will still use firefox even once XUL rubbish an Gecko is gone. people love "New Toys "to play with. sure i'll miss Extensions as they are now but i wont miss anything else. i'll be interested to see if firefox remains default browser in linux soon. they ( Gnome ) are improving the browser Epiphany.

mightyglydd

User avatar
 
Posts: 9025
Joined: November 4th, 2006, 7:07 pm
Location: Hollywood Ca.

Post Posted January 6th, 2017, 3:14 pm

#KeepFightingMichael

Virtual_ManPL

User avatar
 
Posts: 1910
Joined: July 24th, 2008, 5:52 am

Post Posted January 6th, 2017, 5:20 pm

-Arch- wrote:
Virtual_ManPL [:Virtual] - (ni? me) 2017-01-04 02:19:44 PST wrote:So basically in simple, Mozilla want to kill the most powerful weapon Firefox has now - the configurability, customization and possibility to change anything to look how users and extensions developers want.
It's very sad to hear this, especially when this change won't bring Firefox any more user base, it unfortunately probably be otherwise.

firefox has been losing its userbase for sometime so this isnt new, even more users are using Chrome in linux or a webkit/blink based browser anyway.

( sorry for using chrome as im in Sydney over holidays )

Yep, it isn't new, it's mostly due:
- pushing hardware acceleration enabled by default in Firefox 4 (which was very buggy from start)
- pushing Australis (without option to stay with old pre-Australis look)
- "exhausting" release cycle
- killing tabs on "bottom"
- killing themes (as we just have "skins" now...)
- killing addon bar
- killing status bar
- refusing to release stable 64bit build on Windows for very long time
- slow async development
- slow multithreading development
- dropping e10s and wasting years to start working on it yet again
- wasting manpower on mobile operating system (which was doomed from start, since it was incompatible with Android applications)
- pushing Hello
- pushing Pocket
- donations "harassment"
- and also "firing" Brendan Eich (yea, yea, he "left" by himself...)
and probably many many others...



P.S. Please use quote code or at least quotation marks, if you want to quote ;)
Virtualfox persona

Are you ready for deprecation of XUL & XBL & XPCOM extensions? Not?! Try Firefox ESR

ICQ5

User avatar
 
Posts: 1314
Joined: April 11th, 2014, 7:34 pm
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post Posted January 6th, 2017, 6:17 pm

Virtual_ManPL wrote:
-Arch- wrote:
Virtual_ManPL [:Virtual] - (ni? me) 2017-01-04 02:19:44 PST wrote:So basically in simple, Mozilla want to kill the most powerful weapon Firefox has now - the configurability, customization and possibility to change anything to look how users and extensions developers want.
It's very sad to hear this, especially when this change won't bring Firefox any more user base, it unfortunately probably be otherwise.

firefox has been losing its userbase for sometime so this isnt new, even more users are using Chrome in linux or a webkit/blink based browser anyway.

( sorry for using chrome as im in Sydney over holidays )

Yep, it isn't new, it's mostly due:
- pushing hardware acceleration enabled by default in Firefox 4 (which was very buggy from start)
- pushing Australis (without option to stay with old pre-Australis look)
- "exhausting" release cycle
- killing tabs on "bottom"
- killing themes (as we just have "skins" now...)
- killing addon bar
- killing status bar
- refusing to release stable 64bit build on Windows for very long time
- slow async development
- slow multithreading development
- dropping e10s and wasting years to start working on it yet again
- wasting manpower on mobile operating system (which was doomed from start, since it was incompatible with Android applications)
- pushing Hello
- pushing Pocket
- donations "harassment"
- and also "firing" Brendan Eich (yea, yea, he "left" by himself...)
and probably many many others...



P.S. Please use quote code or at least quotation marks, if you want to quote ;)
pushing pocket down peoples throats is/was a mistake .
pushing hello was a mistake
release cycle is a mistake - should of stuck to 2 to 3 releases a year,
dropping e10s and wasting years to start working on it yet again - totally agree
slow multithreading development
sync in Firefox has always been terrible IMO an prolly will never be any good.

Frank Lion

User avatar
 
Posts: 19421
Joined: April 23rd, 2004, 6:59 pm
Location: ... The Exorcist....United Kingdom

Post Posted January 7th, 2017, 5:05 pm

marty60 wrote:The last four months or so Firefox has been making a steady comeback of sorts, going from its low of 7.69% in August to 12.22% currently.

Well, that's good. Although 'being slightly less worse than some other browser' was not really the original idea in the early days of Mozilla.

Still, in other news, the APIs are now all done -
pretty much all the APIs that it makes sense to implement have been done.

http://arewewebextensionsyet.com/

Mozilla are also figuring out their fallback position, as they already know that this stuff is about as popular as a dose of the clap with Firefox extension authors. So, yes they know they all only change webpage content, yes they know that most are total crap, but this (to them) is nothing but numbers...*drumroll* ...by a Mozilla guy, I give you the new Firefox extensions -

http://mckay.pub/2016-11-18-webextensions/

By the way, something odd. In all the Mozilla discussions/blogs/more blogs/we're just like you blogs, etc. that have been droning about this post-XUL business, you see the expected perp extensions coming up. In other words, the expected Adblock/NoScript, various downloader extensions, etc. No surprise, as that is all content. But I keep seeing something else being mentioned - an extension that barely makes it into the Top 50 - Tree Style Tabs. That is a chrome (UI) extension, don't ask me what it means, but it keeps being mentioned. Whether that is to become the token UI extension to refute what we already know about their 'don't touch our UI' policy, is anyone's guess. Odd though.

Firefox will be whatever it will be. But, I will say this - if you like the idea of the Chrome browser, but don't like the 'invasive nature' of Google, then since 2008, you just go here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromium_ ... browser%29

Let's just hope that Mozilla already knew that and weren't pinning their hopes on taking an anti-Google market.
Metal Lion latest SeaMonkey & Thunderbird Themes - Sea Monkey and Silver Sea Monkey
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke (attrib.)

marty60
 
Posts: 467
Joined: March 21st, 2012, 7:09 am

Post Posted January 7th, 2017, 5:59 pm

-Arch- wrote:i tend to think a lot will still use firefox even once XUL rubbish an Gecko is gone. people love "New Toys "to play with. sure i'll miss Extensions as they are now but i wont miss anything else. i'll be interested to see if firefox remains default browser in linux soon. they ( Gnome ) are improving the browser Epiphany.

We'll just have to wait and see what the final version looks like, I've got too many must-have addons so my hope is that Mozilla moves in their typical molasses-like fashion and we get an extra ESR version that keeps XUL going for another year.

marty60
 
Posts: 467
Joined: March 21st, 2012, 7:09 am

Post Posted January 7th, 2017, 6:00 pm

Frank Lion wrote:Well, that's good. Although 'being slightly less worse than some other browser' was not really the original idea in the early days of Mozilla.

Agree, it is good since I think most of us want Firefox to succeed. But I would imagine that Mozilla management is thrilled to death at these numbers since given how far they have fallen in the last few years even crumbs from Google's table is worth celebrating.

As a non-developer who has seen how all this works I'm guessing that even before an official non-XUL version is released some resourceful individuals will have already figured out a way to restore the old addons, or at the very least to hack into the UI so it's configurable again. It is open source. It may be Mozilla's policy to deny that ability but that doesn't mean much with those who are determined.

NanM
 
Posts: 174
Joined: September 16th, 2008, 1:04 am
Location: SW WAustralia

Post Posted January 9th, 2017, 6:25 am

Frank Lion wrote: Tree Style Tabs. That is a chrome (UI) extension, don't ask me what it means, but it keeps being mentioned.


Possibly getting attention because all Piro tab stuff gets it. He's an xul master in his own specialty there.
He authors because he wants it. As far as I know he is full-time employed coding for business users of Fx, so Moz would be right up themselves if they believe they can subvert his excellent skills in any kind of political shutup move.
Or not. Nothing says Piro won't be included in some plan to fork Fx to accomodate corporate users.
A few of our local Fx group use Fx for local file management with Piro's tab extensions. It's a really esoteric field, but the basis is emulating Win Registry hives. Who knew! They're medical office workers.

I've used his Text Link since he wrote it.

Nothing's going to get any clearer until/if Moz brings down the guillotine on xul. My reading of the
ground is that Moz have a limited time to turn AMO into the Mozilla Store (before "apps" isn't an attraction for the general dumb consumer) - which I'm betting they've put all their fundraising hopes on; whether they make that a totally closed shop (no pun intended) or whether they allow eventually different Firefoxes (brandless natch) within their stupid corporate approach nobody will know for a long lot of years. Right now, I'm sure they're cutting off Chrome oxygen to find out what's going to be floating around without it.
I hang on to the small hope that there are enough remaining gifted xul hackers to re-form an open addons
community again.
Meanwhile, I'm happy enough to browse with SM 2.40 - a superb bit of kit that accepts all the extensions I need.

Happy New Year to all btw.

ICQ5

User avatar
 
Posts: 1314
Joined: April 11th, 2014, 7:34 pm
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post Posted January 14th, 2017, 8:18 pm

more here https://www.ghacks.net/2017/01/04/whats ... x-in-2017/

Mozilla to Drop Aurora Channel?

impar
 
Posts: 102
Joined: August 8th, 2007, 1:45 pm

Post Posted January 31st, 2017, 4:29 pm

Quicksaver, the guy from Tab Groups, OmniSidebar, and some other extensions quits:
http://fasezero.com/lastnotice.html

Oh, by the way, I already did all that. It took me a year and a half of extensive rewritting to make my add-ons e10s/multiprocess compatible, something that is being rolled out only now, all with the prospect of a long-lasting life for them. And the WebExtensions announcement was made not two months after. "Demotivating" doesn't quite cover it...

No, that's not going to happen.
Classic Theme Restorer, the solution to the Australis problem!
https://addons.mozilla.org/pt-pt/firefo ... erestorer/

cyrix007
 
Posts: 164
Joined: October 25th, 2006, 1:10 am

Post Posted February 2nd, 2017, 12:27 pm

I plan to keep using the pre-Webextensions version of Firefox ESR after the big changeover. Will my PC have a deep security hole if I do this, even though I have virus and malware protection installed?
Last edited by cyrix007 on February 20th, 2017, 1:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

ICQ5

User avatar
 
Posts: 1314
Joined: April 11th, 2014, 7:34 pm
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post Posted February 2nd, 2017, 2:46 pm

cyrix007 wrote:I plan to keep using the pre-Webextensions version of Firefox ESR after the big changeover. Will my PC have a deep security hole if I do this, even though a have virus and malware protection installed?

no. ESR will be patched with SEC updates

Return to Firefox Builds


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Lurtz and 1 guest